The Lones Group Lesson: Destroying Your Brand Online
Fellow REALTORS:
Incase you’ve been in a cave all day not paying attention to Twitter and Facebook, you might want to read this article at Inman News on how The Lones Group (a “sales and marketing coach/vendor” based in Bellingham, WA) is suing Virginia based REALTOR Daniel Rothamel for what they believe is trademark infringement and “unfair business practices”.
The gist of the complaint, which was filed a couple days ago, is that Daniel’s use of zebra imagery and the name of his Real Estate blog (The Real Estate Zebra) title and theme is an infringement upon The Lones Group’s “Trade Dress” which is also that of a zebra theme. The Lones Group also claims that this… and I quote “was and is calculated to cause injury to Plaintiff in the State of Washington” and therefore is seeking damages in excess of $75,000.
Give me a fucking break!
Besides the fact that (at least as far as I’m aware) you can’t trademark things that are naturally occurring in nature, such as “zebras”… the thing that jumps out at me is the claim that Daniel is purposely causing injury to their business. He’s a REALTOR. In Virginia. The Lones Group is a sales and marketing system vendor. In Washington. I don’t even see a close relation to how there could be ANY confusion between the services the two perform. The Lones Group also claims to be a “preeminent source” for blog resources in the Real Estate industry. Really? I mean, I consider myself to be fairly tuned in to the “who’s who” of the Real Estate blogging vendors, and I had never heard of the Lones Group until today.
Now granted, The Lones Group does cater to Real Estate agents… and Daniel does talk to other Real Estate agents across the country (via Inman’s Agent Reboot tour and related events) about topics that are related to Real Estate sales and marketing, although he has no “product” to sell any of us fellow Realtors. So, that being said, the lawsuit seems like a pretty big stretch and reeks of desperation from a company that is probably already struggling, as some related vendors in the Real Estate space find themselves in this economy.
This really pisses me off!
I’ve known Daniel for about 5 years now. Even before we worked together at Inman News… He’s seriously one of the nicest guys I’ve ever met. So, incase it wasn’t already apparent, to hear that some lame ass company has decided to pick a bone with someone like Daniel for something as frivolous as this, really chaps my hide. So, I (and several others in the industry) let it be known today via Twitter, Facebook, and even direct email correspondence with The Lones Group. Our message surely fell upon tens of thousands of eyeballs in the Real Estate industry.
Here’s the response received via email from Denise Lones (or more likely her legal counsel):
Fellow members of the real estate community,
You may have heard that The Lones Group has filed a lawsuit against Daniel Rothamel and Strong Team Realtors for trademark and trade dress infringement. I am writing to clear up a few misconceptions that some people apparently have about the lawsuit.
We started using zebra images in connection with our business many years ago. And for a long time, we’ve had a real estate blog called “The Zebra Report.” We’ve made a big effort to promote ourselves as the “zebra” people in real estate. And that’s how people see us. When they come across the word “zebra” or see images of zebras in connection with real estate, they think of us.
After we became known for our zebra connection, Rothamel and STR also began to use zebra images and started a blog called “Real Estate Zebra”. This confuses people. It makes them think there’s a connection between us and Rothamel, when there isn’t. Trademark laws were designed to prevent this sort of thing.
We asked our lawyers to request that Rothamel and STR stop using zebras and the term “Real Estate Zebra” to identify themselves. Unfortunately, Rothamel and STR refused. That left us with only one way to protect our identity – a lawsuit. We would have preferred not to file one, but Rothamel and STR left us with no other choice.
We know some people disagree with our position, and that’s to be expected. In any lawsuit, the parties’ friends and associates generally side with the people they know. But at this point, it’s in the court’s hands. We have faith in the American justice system, and we believe that at the end of the day, the court will decide in favor of The Lones Group.
Sincerely,
Denise Lones
I’d like to raise a few points of observation of my own:
There are thousands and thousands of businesses using zebra images. Will The Lones Group sue each of them too?
There are a several other institutions with a “zebra report“. Will the Lones Group sue them?
Looking at the two websites – there is no question in my mind that they are totally unrelated. The zebra theme is the only commonality. Will the Lones Group sue National Geographic? They have zebra related images and themes sometimes.
The response raises no mention of how they feel Daniel is purposely hurting their business. Which makes sense… because HE ISN’T.
Speaking of hurting your business… I’d like Denise Lones to chew on this for a bit:
Like I mentioned above, this message was seen by thousands of Real Estate agents today.
I’ll always have a great story to tell when someone mentions the Lones Group to me in the future. Not that I expect that to happen much, seeing as how I’ve been in the R/E space for about 10 years and had never heard of your company.
Imagine how all this is going to look in about 24 hours when all these blog posts (The Lones Group: Brand Suicide, The Lones Group vs. Rothamel – A Case Study in Destroying Your Online Reputation), Tweets, and Facebook posts start showing up in the Google search results. That may not look very good. But as someone who offers brand and image consulting, you probably already knew that.
Long Live the REAL Real Estate Zebra!
Assuming this does actually progress through the court systems… it’s going to cost Daniel a little chunk of change to fight. Here’s where we can help. Jay Thompson (better known as the Phoenix Real Estate Guy) has started a “Zebra Defense Fund” where we can all contribute money to help Daniel. I very rarely ask my followers for anything favor like. But, if you can spare anything, I (we) would all be grateful!
One last thing. A little disclosure I “borrowed” from Jay Thompson (I’ll watch for the C+D letter Jay) as it so eloquently sums up my situation as well:
I am not an attorney, in any way, shape or form. I consider Daniel Rothamel and his family (also parties to the lawsuit I discuss above) personal friends. And until today, I had never heard of The Lones Group. I have no idea if they are good at what they do, nor do I really care – that’s not the point. Finally, what I stated is simply my personal opinion, which I freely admit is biased and slanted due to my relationship with the Rothamel’s.
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lolol – They say “We’ve made a big effort to promote ourselves as the “zebra” people in real estate.”
Oh REALLY?????? Their metrics say they MAY get 12 visitors a day.
Now they say “After we became known for our zebra connection”…
Pathetic.
Knox – I don’t know who you are (or do I?)… but your site is awesome!
Will I make the blogroll?
Hey Jeff, not sure I “know” you, we have many mutual friends though. My site knoxing.com (no shameless full link drop:) I’m gathering articles and will be spreading some as this goes and I add to that domain. (yes)
Agreed @Knox has a GREAT site
This is going to be ugly (for the Lones Group) by morning…
There are at least 5 blogs that should be on page 1 soon.
Jeff – thanks to you and Jay for writing the blog posts about this. If the Lones Group does want people to be confused, they can put a disclaimer on their website and any other marketing material they have. Just guessing but Daniel probably doesn’t want people to think he is assosiated with the Lones Group either.
Jeff – You said it much better than I did, so I’ll say this: I agree. I like the Lones Group’s email as well, I hadn’t seen that yet. As for the “misconceptions” about the lawsuit – well, from what I can understand (not being a lawyer and all) this email explanation is exactly what I read in the lawsuit. Maybe I’m just smarter than I thought.
#savethezebrasavetheworld
Well said ! This lawsuit is just crazy and sickening ! And you are right, the power of social media will really hurt “the brand” of the Lones Group. I have never heard of them either.
Per her email about “We’ve made a big effort to promote ourselves as the “zebra” people in real estate.” FAIL.
Just because you made an effort, doesn’t mean you were successful and that it is someone else’s fault. What really concerns me is that a “marketing” and self promotion company didn’t see how this would play out.
Maybe she just attended twitter for dummies led by Kenneth Cole.
“Just because you made an effort, doesn’t mean you were successful and that it is someone else’s fault.”
Molly, I couldn’t agree more. In life, if you fail, it’s no one’s fault but your own. End of story. Lones Group needs to learn from their failures, get over it, and move on.
Jeff- Sometimes I just wonder what people think when they take certain actions…
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Next thing we’ll see is everyone suing everyone for using the word “House” or “Home” or showing a picture of a “House” or “Home”. This is ridiculous….
Give me a Flipping break. Compare their websites side by side – nothing close to any infringements.
I hope that I don’t get sued by some German Gamer for using the tag Uber Randy
Prior to yesterday I had no knowledge of Daniel or Denise. So I didn’t “pick” the side of my “friend” I read the available on line news stories and choose to support Daniel. She’s wrong, it’s that simple. And maybe I would have never considered using her for any of my “marketing” needs. But maybe I would have seen her blog on the platform where I also maintain a blog and perhaps, but now… hell no. I hope her stripes fall off.
The more I read the more I understand that had Daniel stayed a Real Estate agent he would have been unnoticed. It sounds like he would like to be something more, a speaker, or trainer. In that case, yes the Lones Group would have to litigate.
Daniel still is a Real Estate agent. He has also worked with Inman for about 4 years off and on (we worked together for nearly 2 years)… he did webinars, blogging, helped with the conferences and just recently took on the role of MC’ing half of the Agent Reboot tour. As such, he offers no “products” or paid coaching. He speaks to agents from his heart and his experience, in the hopes of helping them become better agents and online “marketers” if you will.
So…. I’m going to have to strongly disagree with you on this one.
[...] The Lones Group Lesson: Destroying Your Brand Online [...]
Hey David Losh, Daniel is MC’ing the Agent Reboot Tour here in Seattle. Are you going to come?
My initials are DM – I guess if someone else is using those same initials on the other side of the US, I could face a similar lawsuit, huh? And, heaven forbid I use the word real estate in my domain name–I guess that was taken years ago too so, like zebra, that one has already been taken and is off limits to anyone else who uses it!
My guess–business is down so, this is a good way to make money. Think again! Way to bite the hand that feeds you!
Don’t want to jinx anything, but I’m surprised Maxwell House hasn’t “contacted” you Debe…
Having met Daniel 5 years ago at REBarCamp he’s an all around nice guy. This in itself really doesn’t mean squat. However, I’m in Daniel’s camp on this one. The Lones Group, which I’ve never heard of, is getting a lot of publicity. Poor publicity.
When I can trademark “Pandas” or “Lions” or “Polka Dots” let me know.
Unreal. How dumb could they be? I guess someone had to be the case stud in what not to do. Go Daniel!
[...] I am Jeff: Nobody Is me: The Lones Group Lesson: Destroying Your Brand Online [...]
This lawsuit is a no win deal for the Lones folks. Even if they win in court they will suffer irreparable damage.
BTW, I believe you can trademark a specific thing (animal) e.g., “Mickey Mouse” but just “Mouse”, probably not.
So if that woman called her group “Zack the Zebra” and Daniel did too he might have a problem but I don’t think you can own a whole species
You said it! Lones group can’t seriously think they are the only ones who have the right to use a zebra image. It is an animal – not a created logo/image. There are thousands of companies using zebras in their images. Probably hundreds of them are in the real estate industry. Give me a break. I think it is based on jealously. Daniel is much more well known as the zebra than the Lones group.
Watch out. Daniel, The Lones Group has a “Boot Camp” the phrase may get you in trouble.